Finding Balance, Nurturing Relationships, and Implementing Family Values with Praveen Velu

• [00:39] Introducing today’s guest, Praveen Velu
• [01:57] About meeting his wife
• [04:05] About his kids
• [07:07] On being a new dad and handling a start-up
• [11:40] Most memorable moment as a parent
• [13:00] On discipline, parenting style
• [18:01] Family weekends
• [25:01] On managing sibling relationships
• [26:48] Advice for new parents
• [29:07] Hopes and aspirations as a parent
• [30:11] Lesson learned as a Parent in Tech
• [31:46] Connect with Praveen Velu

TRANSCRIPTION

Qin En 00:01

Hi, I am Qin En and this is the Parent in Tech Podcast.

Welcome to season two, where we interviewed debts, who are technology company leaders, speeches in Southeast Asia. After hearing from moms in season one now it's time to speak to dads who are raising kids while thriving in their careers. Let's find out the stories, challenges, and advice they have for us.

In this episode, we speak to Praveen, Strategic Partnerships Lead in Meta. Praveen started his career in financial broadcast journalism during the global financial crisis with companies including CNBC and Yahoo. He then led network development at the Walt Disney Company in APAC, before co-founding Evie.ai, an AI personal assistant that schedules meetings.

This is one of the must-have tools I myself use in my day job as a venture capitalist. Praveen's management philosophy begins and ends with people and he's a father of two boys, ages two and five.

Qin En 01:16

Hey Praveen. Welcome to the Parents in Tech podcast. To begin with, can you tell us a bit more about your family?

Praveen Velu 01:2299

Thanks for having me. Longtime listener, first-time caller. So my wife and I, have two boys. The first one's five, although he thinks he's 15, and then the other one's almost two years old and can almost be at two places at the same time. There's always dashing about so, it's always quite, let’s say, lively at home.

Qin En 01:41

That's wonderful. Yeah. At this age where they're full of energy, realizing what they can do, especially I'm sure for your youngest son where he started walking for a year and started to be more confident. So it's an exciting time, isn't it?

Praveen Velu 01:54

A bit too confident if you ask me. He tends to tend to jump first and then think about it later.

Qin En 01:59

Uh, that's wonderful. Okay, so Praveen, maybe take me back a bit. How did you meet your wife and when did children or the discussion of children come into the picture?

Praveen Velu 02:09

Yeah, I met my wife, I think about 10 years ago now and of course, she's a perfect stranger. She was organizing the Singapore chapter of an event called Social Media Week.

I don't know if you remember this quite a while back. So her agency colleagues approach the company I was working at then to become a title sponsor and then somehow I got arrowed to attend this meeting. So, okay I was running point on this whole thing and then on the event day, I showed up, she was offering me swag that I had actually sponsored for the event.

I said, “Thank you but I should give that to you". So, that was kind of funny and then we didn't see each other for the rest of the week until the finale event. It was a big event. We had a drink, and some chat, I got challenged to some old-school Super Mario because they had set it up as part of the event team. That didn't go very well for me, but I think by a much, the [00:03:00] last 10 years ago, it was quite fine for me otherwise.

Qin En 03:03 

Wow. Talk about serendipity for that event that you sponsor and I guess based on what you were describing, you didn't sound too excited about that big event but it turned out to be one of the best life decisions you've made.

Praveen Velu 03:15

Yeah, and it's funny because our oldest son was always turned out to be quite a big Super Mario aficionado and we just moved house. So as we went back in, we found his old school Nintendo console we hooked it up for him and my wife is pretty smug about it, she’s like, “You know, I beat your dad and that's how we met". He didn't skip a beat he was like, “Well, I beat both of you, so".

Qin En 03:34

There's a pecking order. There's a hierarchy that is established in the family.

Praveen Velu 03:38

Yeah.

Qin En 03:38

Okay, wonderful. That's such a fascinating and nonconventional story. So Praveen, after you got together when did children come into the picture? Were you guys aligned on how many children, when you want to have children? Maybe shed some light into how those conversations look like.

Praveen Velu 03:54

Yeah, I think it wasn't a very big part of our conversations, but I think at some point after being married for about two years or so, we decided, well, everybody's getting on in years.

So this is probably something that we should get to quickly. So then that's been number one showed up in 2017. And then 2017 was also a very tough year for us because it was as it turned out the last and most intense year of my startup journey. So we decided at that point in time, one and done. And then I think about two years ago, we revisit that decision basically, we're like, “Do we want this guy growing up as a single child? There's a high likelihood that he's going to think the universe revolves around him. Probably, he should have a sibling to keep his feet on the ground". So then I think we decided number two, who also a boy arrived in 2020, and then now we're two and done. Now, the shop’s well and truly shut.

Qin En 04:51

So no optionality for number three?

Praveen Velu 04:54

We're going to do our best not to end up in that situation.

Qin En 04:58

Got it. Okay, Praveen, you gotta tell me a bit more about 2017. The challenges of being a Dad back then, and also what it's like, you mentioned about when you are building your own company.

Yeah. Take us back to that time.

Praveen Velu 05:10

Yeah. So first time dad, so not much experience there, actually none at all. And then also turned out I was been running the startup with my partner then for about three years, at that point. In 2017 was really when things were coming to a head. Basically I'll sink or swim year.

So, on the one hand, I was trying to find revenue, traction, buying customers, paying customers to retain there, and then on the other hand also embarked on fundraising, and then my co-founder at that time also fully headed down in trying to solve what was—and I think still is—a very big technical challenge. Getting machines to understand naturally written and spoken language and then figure out which part of all that text is intended for them to take action and then take the right actions.

So that was a very hard year and then when number one came along, I'm embarrassed to say this now, but I wasn't fully present even when I was at home my mind was somewhere else. We were head employees, we needed to make this work. So that was really hard and the disproportion of the burden fell [on] my wife.

We were, I guess, lucky. I mean, talk about support levels. We were kind of lucky because my mother-in-law who had just recently retired at that point, graciously decided she would come and stay with us for the first year to help us out, so she was a great deal of help. And then my own parents who were here were also helping out in ways that they could on my dad's constantly, even until today I think, is constantly fixing everything that breaks in our house. And then the last thing was that my brother-in-law who just moved to Singapore for a new job was also living with us. So he was basically cooking dinner every night and stuff like that. So I was the absentee in all of that, simply because of what was going on at work, but we leaned very heavily into that support infrastructure that year.

Qin En 07:07

Yeah, absolutely. When things at work and especially when it's your business as a critical phase comes in and you need to be fully involved in it, then that's when the family support comes in to be extremely, extremely valuable. I just, thinking back about also, even in that first year like what did you feel was the dominant emotion that you felt balancing work, being a new dad? All of that.

Praveen Velu 07:31

Yeah. I kept vacillating between terror and guilt. Terror with what was going on at work. I mean, you've been in a startup yourself and a founding role. So you, I think you understand what that's like. And then, just guilt about not being present in this other new role that I was occupying at that time. And my wife having to handle so much of that while she was also looking at it.

Qin En 07:53

How did you come out of it and when did the situation start to improve?

Praveen Velu 07:57

I think at the end of 2017, I just closed our latest at that point around the fundraising and I decided that it look someday has to give, I can't do all of this and that.

So I made the very difficult decision to walk away from my own startup and leave my co-founder just having to take on everything else. But for life and family and everything else, I felt that that was the right thing to do. When the round closed in December, I told the board that I needed to take some time off to basically just recover.

So all of December, it was a lot of walking, a lot of yoga, and a lot of thinking. I came back in January and I informed the board I think it was time for me to move on and then a senior board member made some introductions right off the bat of that conversation and I ended up on Facebook a couple of months later. And then a couple of months after I started, my wife also joined me at the company and we've both been there ever since.

So that's been kind of great for us, a lot of shared context and you know a great company to work for, especially over the last two years when things have been especially hard, being [in] the pandemic and stuff like that.

Qin En 09:09

Yeah. Well, thanks so much for sharing that. I'm sure that must have been probably one of the most challenging and trying periods of time, and maybe talk to me a bit more about the decision to leave because I went through a similar process too, but this is something that you built with your own two hands, of course with your co-founders who gave a lot into it and of course, a lot of emotions, a lot concerns and anxiety around it. What was in your mind that led you to make this decision?

Praveen Velu 09:35

Yeah, it was a lot of mixed emotions sorting through those emotions to gain some clarity that in itself took some time, right? But I think it all came to my final dimension of my decision making was my co-founder and I had different ideas about how we wanted to take this product in this company. And I felt that if I don't have [00:10:00] control over the destiny of this thing, then it's best to take a step back and let somebody else drive this the way they want to drive it. So that was the final, I think, determinant in my decision-making process at that time.

Qin En 10:15

Gotcha. Then after you took the break, you basically transitioned out. I'm curious, how did your relationship with your family changed and evolve after that? Because suddenly from something that you are so consumed by, you had this freedom, this clarity, what changed at home?

Praveen Velu 10:32 

Again, in honesty, I don't think things magically went back to being completely fine. After I joined the new company, that was a lot of financial and emotional burden taken off from my family; and then my wife followed me to the company as well. But as far as presence and being present when I was still then it was a different problem when I was struggling a lot for.

So again, we found ourselves in the situation where I was many time zones away frequently and stuff like that. So I think maybe just to skip ahead in the timeline a little bit, the pandemic actually I'd say has been a bit of a blessing for me because it's given me the opportunity to just stay grounded and be at home and reconnect with number one and then also start off with number two on a better footing. So it's been hard all around I'd say, but this is something that I appreciate from the last two years.

Qin En 11:31

Definitely. I feel like the pandemic has forced us to be a lot more of our families, but in such a good way and change the routines because especially with travel and all of that, that always is challenging.

So talking about the past two years, also with a new bond that you had when the pandemic first struck. What was perhaps one of the most memorable moments you had as a parent over the last two years?

Praveen Velu 11:54

It's always gratifying as I call it, especially at this age, they develop very quickly. So seeing those new feature releases is always a very interesting. [They start to] walk and then they're starting, beginning to say words. And then now the second one is starting to string together full sentences. They’re starting to repeat everything he hears. So, little jugs with big ears thatlike to stay around here. But now we have to be careful about what we're saying around him, in case it gets repeated.

Qin En 12:25

Gotcha. And earlier at the start of this conversation, you said your elder one thinks that he's 15. Tell me a bit more about that.

Praveen Velu 12:32

Yeah, he's a bit of a, I mean you could tell from his response to the whole Mario thing, he’s a bit of an old soul. He is quite eloquent, so he's not afraid to take us on and forces us to be on feet actually we cannot arbitrarily say do this or do that. We're having to [be] like judges and lawyers explain our decisions in full, laying out the rationale and citing precedents at times before we can compel his cooperation.

Qin En 13:00

Yeah. And so I guess on that, those would probably talk to me a bit more about the way you think about discipline. because I think in, I would say perhaps in the way that we were brought up as children, often, whatever our parents say counts and it's almost like because I'm your parent, I don't need to give any reason. But clearly you're adopting a different approach. How was it like for you and what led you to this most thoughtful and inclusive approach?

Praveen Velu 13:25

Yeah. Just say here that all the credit, I think should go to my wife who's been a big part of shaping a good approach to our philosophy on parenting and stuff like that. I, as you just alluded to seem like you, let's say we grew up in a more ‘80s parenting style. Uh, first responses tend to be a bit more sterner, let's just say. But my wife on the other hand is the one that tries to be nonreactive to the tantrums and the meltdowns and then slowly have those conversations and tries to reason with them. It's not the most efficient way of doing things, especially these meltdowns can take place anytime anywhere, and stuff like that. But I think the way we think about it is the same way as doing things in a short-cap fashion builds up technical debt. When you're building products, taking those shortcuts early on can also build up emotional debt later on with the kids. Right? So I fall down on this quite often so my wife is the one that really holds the line on this.

Qin En 14:26

Got it. That's such a quotable quote, just like how your product you take shortcuts you have a technical debt. Now, if you do the same in parenting, you also accumulate emotional depth which I think it's a foul system, getting technical debt, but it's true.

Praveen Velu 14:41

It's less reversible.

Qin En 14:42

Yes, indeed. Okay, so we talked a lot of course about the challenges, Praveen, but I still want to talk about the good moments. So what's so far the best part about being a dad?

Praveen Velu 14:54

Maybe, let me try to answer this another way. Before kids in your twenties and early thirties and stuff like that, the thing you like to do is hang out with your friends and enjoy your freedom a lot and back then, we used to do that almost every day after work.

And I used to have these older colleagues who would be like half a pint of beer go “Oh, I need to get back to my kids and somebody”, you could never relate or understand like, why wouldn't you want to socialize? And stuff like that. But after having our own kids, I really can't imagine not being home for dinner and I feel really bad if I didn't see them before bed.

The other day in anticipation of this conversation, I asked my wife “So what's so great about being a mom”? and she goes, wine glass in her hand at the end of the day was like, “Actually, nothing”. but then she also followed on she said, “If somebody gave me a time machine to go back before all this, I get my time, my freedom and all my energy back; I'd still fight very hard to continue on this timeline”.

So if you build a pro-con list of being a parent, the con side of it be very heavy, but still, it's a thing that you would still choose to do having done so. [00:16:00] And it's a strange thing, and it's a thing that's very hard to understand but once you've been a parent I think you wouldn't choose to go back the other way.

Qin En 16:08

Absolutely. I think this is gold, especially for those who are listening and perhaps are going to be parents or the ones thinking about being parents, or those who are not parents yet. Because, the part about they have to leave early for dinnersmiss drinks, it's so true. Before that, it's always nice to hang out with friends too late, have a couple of drinks and all of that and then you always feel like those, uncool, “Parents are the most  uncool bunch". that I just had to go back and view of it, but it's also such a different kind of happiness and satisfaction that, what can other interactions give?

Praveen Velu 16:40

Yeah. And the ability to do things on a lot now we are highly scheduled to meet our friends. It's something you put in the calendar two weeks in advance and the way a restaurant booking business going right now even after a month or so before you can find a place to meet with your friends and stuff like that.

Qin En16:55

So correct.

Praveen Velu 16:56

But still, I think people who've been parents wouldn't want it any other way.

Qin En 17:02

So, one of the things was, something I wanted to ask because you have two kids and this is also for my learning. It's obvious that kids grew up with same parents, same family, but turned out to be quite different. I know it's too early, but what kind of differences are you observing between your elder and your younger boy?

Praveen Velu 17:19

You think they'd be more similar but they're not. Let's just think of a physical disposition, I think the first one he's a bit more cautious, he's probably the one who's more likely to sit down and curl up with a book or something like that. The second one just cannot stay at home I think it takes up to his mom like, they just cannot be at home they need to be out and about, and they need to be running, climbing, doing something. So that is one early difference that we've spotted. Personality-wise, I don't think it'd be fair to say, no? I think there's not fully formed yet and we don't want to typecast at this time. So I think we're more just observing to see what the differences are.

Qin En 18:01

Okay. So with the different proclivities, tell me how do weekends look like for your family. Because on one hand, you have your elder one who probably likes to be at home and chill whereas the younger one wants to go out and play so what do the weekends look like?

Praveen Velu 18:16 

So the first day of the weekend, usually one day of the weekend is when the extended family comes over. My parents, my brother sister-in-law and both my brothers in law, they're all here so it's a long lunches stretching into dinner that kind of thing. That's usually either Saturday or Sunday depending on people's schedules. And then Sunday, if the families aren't coming over, then we're a bit at loose ends because we've got the kids all to to ourselves and no help. So it's usually my wife saying, let's go to the zoo for the 500th time or you know let's just get out to the park or something like that, and then number two is right there with her, ready to go.

Myself and number one a bit more like, “How about we have breakfast first and then maybe we can go down to the pool or something"? just dragging our feet. So then the rest of the day becomes kind of organic especially in the last week has been very hard to plan and go anywhere because of all the restrictions and stuff like that.

But I think we've been quite fortunate within our condo we have this amazing community and we've become quite good friends with a lot of our neighbors and our kids also have a similar age and they're all good friends. And then a lot of times we ended up just hanging out with our neighbors in the conduit which for number one it is fantastic.

Qin En 19:33

Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's so wonderful how you have these different layers of support networks. So what I hear it's of course the extended family that really helps out with the childcare bit and then even within your residential community. I mean, for parents who are thinking about building that support network, that system, what is some advice you would give to them? Because sometimes it can be so hard these days, especially with COVID and everything. You don't really meet people that much in-person what [00:20:00] worked for you?

Praveen Velu 20:01

I'm quite lost to extrapolate from my anecdotal experiences. I think a lot of it is that we are just locked into this situation because a lot of our friends, our close friends either newly married or single and they don't have kids and stuff like that.

Qin En 20:19

Right.

Praveen Velu 20:19

And it just so turned out that we ended up in this condo where it's very family-centric, kids running around everywhere. I’d tell you where this condo is, but we're all trying to keep rents down, so, maybe not so much.

Qin En 20:33

I was going to say it should be other marketing material: “family-friendly".

Praveen Velu 20:37

Yeah, we’re trying to keep our rents. I think your point can be really hard working and there is time keeping up with your own friends as it is now you have to build a new network for your kids. Maybe a good starting point is schools and starting with playdates with classmates.

Qin En 20:55

Yeah. Does the elder one go for those do you guys organize playdates?

Praveen Velu 20:59

His playdates mostly tend to take place with his condo friends they tend to rotate amongst the houses. But once in a while, because we had this setup here I think there's been less of an impetus to set up play dates with his school friends as well, but certainly, those have happened in the past.

Qin En 21:16

Yeah, that's wonderful. Maybe I should start sourcing that within my estate, a play day. Cause this is all convenient like, the playdates; it's not like you have to drive them it's all within the same space so it's much easier to manage.

Praveen Velu 21:27

Yeah and then convenience trumps most things else. I think, given the positive of time that we all experienced these.

Qin En 21:33

Exactly. Okay, so Praveen you built your career in tech so tell me do you use any tech tools in your parenting or to basically create more time and opportunity for your family?

Praveen Velu 21:46

I'll tell you the one tech tool that we've tried to avoid and failed miserably: screens. Before we had kids, we were not going to be those parents and would allow screens until much later. And you're going to spend the time reading and we had all these ideas about how we sit around and we'll discuss these books and stuff like that.

It didn't pan out that way and I don't know if technology has become more intuitive or if kids are born into a different understanding of technology these days. We got the first one, by the time he could walk, he was walking up to the TV and swiping the TV screen. He expects that all screens are swipable and he could very competently navigate Spotify and find the songs even though he couldn't...

Qin En 21:26

Wow.

Praveen Velu 22:27

Just somehow they've managed to figure these things out.

Qin En 22:31

Okay.

Praveen Velu 22:31

But a couple of tools that I would recommend for parents, especially for the new parents. Number one is definitely getting a webcam and making sure that your wifi network at home is low-latency so then you can stop to get there while they're thinking about it and get that before they faceplant off the bed.

The other tool that, I mean, this is just a small example but a low-tech tool that we found was a kids' knife. When number one got to, I think, three and a half four we've got this kid's knife it's serrated but it's not sharp and you can teach them about knife safety he can cut his own strawberries and his own foods and stuff like that without losing an unacceptable number of fingers.

But it was a nice way, very low-tech, but was a nice way of giving him a sense of independence. Now we're on calls and stuff like that he eats a snack he'll just go and figure it out himself. Other than that, I think to the main point of your question.

Qin En 29:29

Yeah.

Praveen Velu 23:29

No, we've been quite remarkably low tech so far. I think we're trying to encourage boredom, less screen time, that sort of thing.

Qin En 23:37

Okay. I'm going to ask about screen time, but I just want to say a side note. See, that's why I do this podcast. I never knew that such kids' knives existed but it just makes so much sense to get them to build those skills, to build confidence in handling dangerous things.

Wonderful. Okay. I’ll head to Lazada [or] Shopee—even though my daughter is only six—maybe a bit later.

Praveen Velu 23:58

 Maybe we can find it for you and then you can put it in the show notes.

Qin En 24:02

Yes. That's a good idea. A good recommendation. Okay, so maybe going back to the screen time part, how do you regulate that these days? Because the relationship can be tenuous at times.

Praveen Velu 24:12

Yeah. On weekends I think it's a bit harder given the extended family is around and on the other days, we try to get out so we, so we do kind of okay. On weekdays number one's in school, number two is about to start school in a week. Anyway, number two is not in front of screens, so that's okay but by the time they come home and have dinner the rule is you're allowed about 45 minutes of television after you've had your shower and are in your PJs.

And that's also largely due [to] necessity because we especially my wife we need to sort ourselves out; take our own showers and get PJ's before we can put them to bed and stuff like that. So 45 minutes usually start with and now he does it himself he goes by saying “Hey, Google set a timer for 45 minutes". and then switches on the TV and then when the timer goes off [he stops].

Qin En 24:58

Wow.

Praveen Velu 24:59

That's pretty much the end of it.

Qin En 25:00

Okay.

Praveen Velu 15:01

One tech tool to kind of offset the impact of the other.

Qin En 25:04

Yeah. Okay. Well, it’s nice that you also have a Google home to kind of set that and build that habit. Also tell me a bit more about how perhaps the elder one and his relationship with the younger one. Because I think for many parents perhaps considering or planning for their second child as always this questions around, “Oh, well he or she be a bully like the other one? Or where they looked out for the younger ones"? How did that relationship between both of them shape over the past two years?

Praveen Velu 25:32

When number two was born, I think immediately we notice a change in behavior in number one. Like he just started throwing tantrums more and stuff like that. I think he was now adjusting to not being the center of attention anymore so over the years we've had to mitigate that and number two needs a disproportionate level of care because he can't fend for himself.

We're very careful to make sure number one is included in everything and not [feeling] left out. And my wife, of course the pandemic has kind of made things a little harder, but there are times when we take him out separately. I pick him up from school and then I go for lunch with him. Or my wife would just take him out to the arts and science museum or something, just hang out with him. And then also, this constant encouragement of “He is your brother and you're kind of responsible for him as well". give him that sense of ownership and responsibility in that relationship.

Then as number two has started to get older and be a lot more, he also naturally gravitates to number one. So he makes it up when he is being called to go to bed he makes sure he's wherever he is he'll run-up to the living room and call for number one and say, “Let's go".

Qin En 26:42

Wow.

Praveen Velu 26:42

When he says “Let's go". he means “If I'm going to bed, you're coming with me".

Qin En 26:48

Aw, that's so beautiful to see how that relationship evolves, and I'm sure you'll continue to be. I think that's the nice thing also about having more than one child is that they have this relationship with each other that's very different from a parent-child relationship. So probably if let's say I gave you a billboard tomorrow that’s targeted at all new parents. What would you kind of write on that billboard?

Praveen Velu 27:11

This is easy. It will be outside Tanglin mall and it would say, “Dude, you've bought way too much stuff".

Qin En 27:20

 Okay. Please elaborate a bit, yes.

Praveen Velu 27:22

When number one was born, we were equipped the way I think the SAF is equipped. We had something for every possible scenario.

Qin En 27:29 

Right.

Praveen Velu 27:30

And then you realize that you don't even use half or three-quarters of these things. There are a few absolute necessities and you will keep going back to those necessities. The rest of it, a lot of them, we gave away having maybe tried it once or twice and then just never used it at all. And then number two it was a much cleaner operation when it comes to buying things, my advice to new parents is whatever you think you need, you probably don't.

Qin En 27:59

True. There's always this excitement and I think these days they do. I mean, the way kids shop sell stuff is done very well everything looks cute, everything looks nice, everything looks fun and then you realize that you clutter your house.

Praveen Velu 28:12

Yeah. And you'd be like, “Huh. What if I'm sitting on the floor and I want to put the child to bed. Is there a chair that also kind of bounces? Is that like, oh, their bouncy chairs let's get one". And then you never use it.

Qin En 28:26

Other than bouncy chairs, what's one other thing you bought that pretty much had no utility and you either gave it away or it's just sitting somewhere.

Praveen Velu 28:34

Okay. This one talks about never having learned from the lesson. This is a stroller attachment it's a flatbed stroller attachment. So basically just sleep in it. Well, guess what the chair with the stroller comes with also reclines all the way down. So in the end between carrying this cumbersome, I forgot what it's called bassinet attachment and just going with the stroller you just end up going with the stroller. [00:29:00] And for some reason, second time around was when we made the same mistake, and then carousel Facebook marketplace sold them at the same time.

Qin En 29:07

Got it. See, that's so relatable! Because I think parents are always excited we do plenty of research, but spending all of this and that's really, really cool. Praveen, so in terms of thinking about what your hopes and your aspirations for yourself as a parent, what are some of those as you look forward in the near future?

Praveen Velu 29:27

I think in the end all of this is so that when the kids grew up you will have a good and meaningful relationship and you are all family at the end of the day and these are the closest people to you in the world. And I think, if at the end of the day you grew up and you're all friends, and you're all really close and I'm not terribly eloquent on this question, but I think that's the real test in the end. That they grow up to be a good people and the kind of people who are confident in themselves always bet on themselves and the type of people, you know you can drop them anywhere in the world and they'll be able to figure it out. They’d be able to build networks, find their own way and be kind to others. And the kind of people who will always look for you and want to be around you they turn life. Yeah.

Qin En 30:14

I mean, you say not eloquent. I think there's no better way of putting in for you to raise people who are for children who can be an independent, positive contribution to society but at the end of the day, they value and the treasure their relationship with you, I think that's across all of that. That's very well put. So to wrap up today's conversation if there's one lesson you have learned as a parent in tech, what would that lesson be?

Praveen Velu 30:37 

I think the subject of work-life balance comes up a lot, especially in our field. The thing where I've arrived at on this is that my belief about work is, work is what we do to give us the means to live a good life and also meaning. And what I mean by there's a sense of structure and purpose in life. And I think, certainly, I've seen this play out in my life and my career, the different seasons in your life, and sometimes the balance will shift more heavily towards work and we talked about that way in 2017 startup.

Sometimes you get a bit of downtime for work and you can focus on other areas of life and I think these shifts back and forth things that add richness to your lived experiences. What I think should be avoided is a chronic shift towards the one or the other, because I think that can lead to stagnation. More than anything else you want to avoid stagnation in life.

Qin En 31:34

That's golden. I think it's true there are times where we just need to step up, but it's back at home or at work but not to just be in that zone for too long until we become uncomfortable and we stop growing over there.

Praveen Velu 31:46 

Or you become too comfortable and you stop growing over there.

Qin En 31:49

Well, Praveen this has been a really, really enjoyable conversation I personally learned so much from it if our audience would love to connect with you, how can they reach you?

Praveen Velu 31:58

I'm on LinkedIn. So you can find me. And actually I wanted to say something about this earlier on in my life in Korea, one of the things that I thrived on is connecting with people and really facilitating connections between people.

If that was a full-time job, I'll do it. But again, after becoming a parent pandemic and stuff like that, that’s kinda fallen off. So one of my goals this year 2022 is we start to be open and hopefully life would go back to normal. Kick off this habit of connecting with people and just hearing about what people are doing in the world, and then hopefully facilitate useful connections between people as well. So please, I'd love to hear from you or you find me on LinkedIn please feel free to reach out.

Qin En 32:41

Awesome! Well, thank you so much for joining us today Praveen. This has been a really enjoyable conversation and yeah, just really appreciate it. 

Praveen 32:44

Thank you.

Thanks for listening to the Parents in Tech Podcast with me, your host, Qin En. We hope you were inspired on how to raise kids and build companies. To catch up on earlier episodes or stay updated with upcoming ones head over to www.parents.fm to join our community of parents in tech. There, you can also drop me a question, idea, feedback, or suggestion. Once again, the website, it's www.parents.fm. That's all for this episode, folks.

See you next time.